Counter Strike Confederation - s9-player-rep-election

There are 2 slots open for Rules Committee Player Representatives this election. Please keep all general discussion of player rep candidates and the election process to this chat. Stay on topic within this channel and these threads. This means no GIFs/memes. Each individual thread is for direct question and answer with candidates. After a question is asked, candidates can use reply with their answer. You can ask as much as you'd like, but understand it may take time for candidates to respond, and if you want to discuss answers or someone else's question, do so in the main discussion chat.

2:02 PM

ChelsBells

2:02 PM

Zyra

2:03 PM

N1

2:04 PM

Comrad

2:04 PM

u4eUhh

@COW | Saunce just to clarify, rules committee really only makes/modifies the rules, admins and other bodies interpret and execute them

1

PFA | yeti2

@COW | Saunce just to clarify, rules committee really only makes/modifies the rules, admins and other bodies interpret and execute them

Thank you for the clarification. I'll delete the questions since hopefully anyone who gets the spot won't stop at eehhhhhh they know what we mean

I appreciate you wanting to engage in the process :)

Also for @FA | katiesleepy an alternative schedule was done during S7 for Premier and it bombed out really hard. Premier had significantly more success this past season with the standard schedule. We, however, do still keep alternative schedules in mind when we make final decisions for the season.

RC has handled the rules on teams rescheduling their own games

3:38 PM

But not the overall schedule of the season.

FYI rules is moving over to github, with table of contents

Does RC have strike based restrictions?

4:52 PM

(I assume not, just curious)

I believe not formally no

PFA | yeti2

FYI rules is moving over to github, with table of contents

UPS | Raasck

Does RC have strike based restrictions?

These are the guidelines

For the purposes of future elections and governing thresholds for revoking membership, RC members will be treated as staff internally.

and

For future RC Player Rep elections, any non-admin, non-GM may run for the spot of a normal player representative if they have played in at least one season.

Til i couldve applied for this

5:32 PM

sorry fam, next time

7:39 PM

the original rationale for disallowing mods was pretty poor so we corrected it last season and allowed it

I thought player rep was for non staff. Was wondering how you got on as staff MONKAS

7:44 PM

My bad on not describing the notice very well this time around

Sorry for missing that in the notices

Next time

who deleted my stuff

8:30 PM

it's from a children's movie

At the top it literally says no memes or gifs….

oh my fault then. I was in the wrong

8:32 PM

thanks jermz

I mean it’s an election it should be kept serious

absolutely. I messed up

megatallicayer

Next time

you dont want to be there

1

10:59 PM

trust me

hi nolan

@OS | Icarus 🏆🏆🏆 "while rescheduling a single match after the following match day might seem simple, in reality it gets incredibly complicated because you're involving a minimum of 4 teams (both initial teams and the teams they play the next match day) but potentially even more teams could be impacted by just one single game rescheduled in this manner. This issue is compounded for every additional match that is rescheduled." thats not true? if i reschedule MD1 to 2 weeks from the first matchday on a non-default time, it doesn't affect any team except for the teams playing? if i have a game on tuesday the 23rd (random dates), and i reschedule it to the 7th of september, how would that affect any team other than the teams playing "So while what you're talking about seems like a simple thing to implement you're talking about tracking multiple rescheduled matches across several committees that include dozens of people who are already having to track the regular season schedule and key dates and times around the rest of the leagues schedule. IMHO unless you create a scheduling committee or place a single individual in charge of scheduling, what you're proposing will result in a giant mess that will be very difficult to track and understand and be all but impossible to follow." this is incredibly simple to track. create a channel where both teams have to agree to a reschedule, write down which team requested the reschedule, and if neither team can agree on a time by the end of the season then the team that requested a reschedule FFs. I don't understand why everything in CSC needs to be made as complicated as possible or how this is supposed to affect "several committees that include dozens of people", if people can't communicate well enough to reschedule a video game or to FF then that just seems like poor life skills

2:35 PM

moved it to here because i dont think its relevant to comrad specifically and its discussing a response of a response of a response of a...

i mean it does affect the info available to other teams. Don't know the original context for this message though

2:42 PM

And isn't that basically what we do now? Screenshot proof of the reschedule offer and acceptance and post it in the right spot

djtl

i mean it does affect the info available to other teams. Don't know the original context for this message though

comards discussion has it (edited)

djtl

And isn't that basically what we do now? Screenshot proof of the reschedule offer and acceptance and post it in the right spot

both teams figure out their reschedule in dms, ss proof with the correct transaction msg in transactions, then its done

2:45 PM

+forwarded to a channel dedicated to any staff that would need the information

1

djtl

i mean it does affect the info available to other teams. Don't know the original context for this message though

by info do you mean things like map preferences? if so imo that info is already gonna be fucked if a team has to FF or play with 2-3 subs because its not the actual team. if you mean something else by info then ignore this xd

FA | katiesleepy

@OS | Icarus 🏆🏆🏆 "while rescheduling a single match after the following match day might seem simple, in reality it gets incredibly complicated because you're involving a minimum of 4 teams (both initial teams and the teams they play the next match day) but potentially even more teams could be impacted by just one single game rescheduled in this manner. This issue is compounded for every additional match that is rescheduled." thats not true? if i reschedule MD1 to 2 weeks from the first matchday on a non-default time, it doesn't affect any team except for the teams playing? if i have a game on tuesday the 23rd (random dates), and i reschedule it to the 7th of september, how would that affect any team other than the teams playing "So while what you're talking about seems like a simple thing to implement you're talking about tracking multiple rescheduled matches across several committees that include dozens of people who are already having to track the regular season schedule and key dates and times around the rest of the leagues schedule. IMHO unless you create a scheduling committee or place a single individual in charge of scheduling, what you're proposing will result in a giant mess that will be very difficult to track and understand and be all but impossible to follow." this is incredibly simple to track. create a channel where both teams have to agree to a reschedule, write down which team requested the reschedule, and if neither team can agree on a time by the end of the season then the team that requested a reschedule FFs. I don't understand why everything in CSC needs to be made as complicated as possible or how this is supposed to affect "several committees that include dozens of people", if people can't communicate well enough to reschedule a video game or to FF then that just seems like poor life skills

I wouldn't be happy with a reschedule that didn't have a set date. Rn rules don't allow scheduling forwards but I personally would be fine with those if committees had workflows to make that happen, however every game needs a set date imo

AVI | Fuffy 🏆

I wouldn't be happy with a reschedule that didn't have a set date. Rn rules don't allow scheduling forwards but I personally would be fine with those if committees had workflows to make that happen, however every game needs a set date imo

i assume ur talking about the part where i said " if neither team can agree on a time by the end of the season then the team that requested a reschedule FFs"?

Yes

to me that's both for reschedule without a set date (not allowed in rules rn afaik) but also if you have to like reschedule a reschedule or if both teams talk about something like that, or if a team just doesn't show up to the reschedule

I'm imagining something closer to esea but without the request system cuz everything would be in DMs

although the 3rd one you could probably argue that the team that doesn't show up has to FF (if they already agreed to it) (edited)

2:49 PM

i dont have a set stance on reschedules without a specific date but even if you reschedule with a set date that just is after the next matchday (ex MD1 to the week of MD4/5) i still think that what i was saying in general was focused on that

2:50 PM

reschedules without a specific date is just another example for me but i don't really have a strong stance on that

2:50 PM

as long as you enforce FFs against teams that break reschedules i don't think that it's that difficult

2:51 PM

[this is all under the idea that reschedule rules could be changed to have more leniance for premier (or in general but esea affects premier the most so i was curious about that)]

As long as everything for servers can work then id also be down with more open rescheduling.

AVI | Fuffy 🏆

As long as everything for servers can work then id also be down with more open rescheduling.

how do servers work for non-default days? are they paid for by the game, by the month, etc

2:54 PM

cuz i got 0 idea

The thing is we don't want to overwhelm a system which is why many are cautious. Servers cost money to spin up and run, tech spins then up for matches and events

2:55 PM

I'm no expert on it but I also know we have our system set to auto so servers/configs using the match data (which is how it syncs with /match)

so if u reschedule you have to have someone manually set config and servers for the day

2:55 PM

or

yes

1

also have TMs around to do last minute transactions

^ yes if teams use subs then TMs are needed at that time

Splatmonkey 🏆

also have TMs around to do last minute transactions

2 questions for this 1) if you have all the normal members of the team is there any extra stuff here 2) can they be input earlier (like for ex if i know 1 guy cant do the reschedule but we have someone ready, can we submit it at the same time we submit the reschedule)

FA | katiesleepy

2 questions for this 1) if you have all the normal members of the team is there any extra stuff here 2) can they be input earlier (like for ex if i know 1 guy cant do the reschedule but we have someone ready, can we submit it at the same time we submit the reschedule)

no and yes

1

for 2 it would be extremely hard to keep track of

2:59 PM

as far as I understand how core works im not sure if you can do subs for future match days

2:59 PM

then you are asking for human error which will always happen

i guess i'd ask another question then: do/could/should reschedules have a different channel and/or thread compared to other transactions

2:59 PM

for organization reasons

you have to wipe subs every match day

OS | Cash 🏆

you have to wipe subs every match day

so if i submit a reschedule this week for 2 weeks from now, TMs have to put in the sub request on the match day closest to the rescheduled date?

or up to night of

why? is it a core thing or

yeah core thing

1

^

currently for reschedules on non-MDs (as in wednesdays/fridays/etc), whats the current practice with subs

3:02 PM

are they put on the rescheduled date or at the start/end of the closest MD

3:02 PM

or just whenever someones most available

FA | katiesleepy

or just whenever someones most available

this one

is there a written rule or anything pertaining to it or no

3:03 PM

id assume not because if its just whenever someones available thats not really a rule

3:03 PM

lol

yeah its just however TMs choose to do it

3:03 PM

which is why it ends up being whenever someone is available

This past season(was TM head) it was when I could get the reschedule in and very rarely did a gm reschedule ahead of time. most were 1 to 2 hours prior to the match

[this kinda diverts from the original discussion which was more generalized about flexibility vs the specifics behind a rule but w/e] so maybe a rescheduled to the future MD (as in more than what is currently allowed) would have to specify no subs? not sure if that would be more or less accommodating though for teams because i think it would be easier on the transactions side (edited)

Also due to previous history with subs saying they are available and then not being available, if a sub is placed in transactions a week early, we still ask for a reverification that the player is still able to participate before finalizing it through core

3:05 PM

otherwise we have ended up with situations where the sub doesnt show even though they said they could a week ago and then the team misses the transaction deadline before match time to resubmit a new sub

3:05 PM

it for protection of the players in that case

a thing that came up this season when someone asked to reschedule out of order is that even though the match is moved, its still that matchday and you can only play for a single team per matchday. Keeping track of that would be v hard, no?

3:07 PM

with subs

yeah that was a major issue when we had a flex schedule in season 7

its a pain in the ass. Premier season 7 was a nightmare to keep track of PFAs

1

3:07 PM

and FAs

premier season 7 had a match rescheduled that somehow still ended up with multiple challenger players subbing

3:08 PM

it was fucking awful

if you don't allow subs for matches scheduled past the next MD would there be any other technical limitations/transaction-side limitations

because you can only play for one team on a given "match day" as an FA and then you cant play for the same team two match days in a row, regardless of the order in which the games are played

1

scraps

because you can only play for one team on a given "match day" as an FA and then you cant play for the same team two match days in a row, regardless of the order in which the games are played

and there were still multiple occasions we missed things and players subbed multiple times on the same matchday PepeLaugh

HG | andrew 🏆

and there were still multiple occasions we missed things and players subbed multiple times on the same matchday PepeLaugh

it was horrible to try to keep straight

from a player POV i would rather have to play like 3-4 games in a week because of reschedules but with my team vs FFs/having to sub in two+ players for a game

@FA | katiesleepy is now level 15 !

1

thanks bot

but that is also asking other teams to play 3-4 times in a week, which is unreasonable given the nature of the league

scraps

but that is also asking other teams to play 3-4 times in a week, which is unreasonable given the nature of the league

But rn the alternative is FF or play with subs, and if the other team isnt willing to play they can say no

3:11 PM

In practice if another team never wants to play more than twice a week then they can just decline all reschedules

its expected for teams to have to use subs throughout the season

If the other team wants to then yeah

3:12 PM

Ok wait

3:12 PM

Cash deleted

3:12 PM

My message dont make sense

I think I read it wrong

Gimmie like 10 minutes im eating and i hate phone

Original message was deleted or could not be loaded.

a) i don't think this is going nowhere, i'm asking people what they would think about very specific ideas/changes to rules so i/we/anyone can look at see what the opinions are about the topic, just because there isn't a conclusion of either Yes do X or No don't do X doesn't mean it shouldn't be had, if other people think so they can but I don't so

1) generally, i asked comrad about any plans to change reschedule rules and subbing rules, specifically in premier because imo it's the tier that needs reschedules the most or multiple subs in a team at once, and esea scheduling is a big reason for that specifically i'm just curious about if there are ways to lower the burden on transactions/people outside of the team when rescheduling past the next MD 2) i don't agree that these are even issues for other teams. If i am on the other team and another team wants to reschedule, if my team cannot do it i can decline. This is true both for current rules and a rule where you could reschedule past 1 MD. in terms of map vetoes and preferences of other teams, I think that when a team vetoes with a sub, they can already be vetoing differently vs normal, so i don't think that's a relevant concern for the other team. Other than declining/maps, i don't understand how the other team(s) are even involved for subs, i don't have a solution or stance one way or the other which is why i'm curious on a) how it works on the technical/TM side and b) if people would like/dislike a rule where, for instance, matches scheduled past 1 MD cannot have subs, subs must be submitted (x) amount of time before for rescheduled games, etc i don't have a definite stance on a rule for this which is why i'm not posting it in serious suggestions, i'm just asking other people on how they think about it

3:31 PM

also in practice getting subs is already a pain in the ass, last season everytime i needed to get a sub i was asking upwards of 10 people per game, half wouldn't respond, i had to look for different tiers and players there too, so my initial question to comrad was also asking about if he had any intentions/ideas about changing sub rules or anything related to that, given that he responded with " I believe it is better for the league when all five players on a team are able to play in as many matches as possible" to my original prompt, that was a good enough answer to me to whether or not he would be open to discussing sub rules that could better accommodate players/teams (imo particularly in premier but maybe that's not actually true and just feels like it due to who i know

)

3:32 PM

:typers: how the fuck yall have so many different ones (edited)